No, I never go to the movies much anymore. The last ones were the Lord Of the Rings triology.

Hmmm, that suggests some modern analogies. "One Rove to bind them, one Rove to rule them all ..."

D. Benson, I left a comment for you on the last thread.
David, have you been to the Universal website? That lame movie is being shot all to pieces! That's what they get for lying, wild horses couldn't drag me to see that! They're too late, the people are hip to the truth. Thanks for the new thread.

Let's talk about Israel signing the Non-Proliferation Treaty, that they demand that Iran and Iraq abide by. Let's discuss why Iraq and Iran's persistent request to have the middle east become a "nuclear free zone" are constantly ignored in the U.s. press.

Hey David ever think about using your power to shed some light on this issue?

13 November 1995
GA/DIS/3038
URGENT STEPS TOWARD NUCLEAR-WEAPON-FREE ZONE IN MIDDLE EAST SOUGHT IN DRAFT APPROVED WITHOUT VOTE IN FIRST COMMITTEE
19951113Israel Says Attempt To Lift Nuclear Issue Out of Context Would Detract From Peace Talks; Iraq Says Nuclear-Free-Zone Has To Precede Lasting Peace

The General Assembly would urge all parties directly concerned to consider taking urgent steps to establish a nuclear-weapon-free zone in the Middle East, according to a draft resolution approved this afternoon without a vote by the First Committee (Disarmament and International Security). As a means to that end, the Assembly would invite them to adhere to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons.

Pending establishment of such a zone, the Assembly would call on all countries of the region to agree to place all their nuclear activities under International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) safeguards. It would invite them not to develop, produce, test or otherwise acquire nuclear weapons or permit their stationing on their territories.

www.scienceblog..nov.13 1995

IMAGINE Israel being pressured to play by the same Non-Proliferation Treaty that they want everyone else to play by. IMAGINE

Nuclear Israel: Belling the cat
By Ehsan Ahrari

In an era of intense global support for nuclear non-proliferation, Israel's unspoken possession of a nuclear arsenal - euphemistically known as an outcome of its policy of "strategic ambiguity" - is coming under increased criticism and limelight. Mohammad ElBaradei, director of the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) - the United Nations' nuclear watchdog - visited Israel on Tuesday to talk to the government of Prime Minister Ariel Sharon about making the Middle East a nuclear-free zone. Even though a spokesman of that agency denied that ElBaradei's mission was to ask the Jewish state to unravel its nuclear-weapons program, one is hard pressed to know how else that region would ever become a nuclear-free zone. According to the unclassified estimates of the US intelligence community of the late 1990s, Israel possesses between 75 and 130 nuclear weapons.

If one were looking for a gaping example of US nuclear non-proliferation policy double standards, that it lets Israel continue to modernize its nuclear arsenal without even a word of criticism would fit the bill. Not that Washington was ever oblivious to the existence of such Israeli capabilities. On the contrary, as the website of the Federation of American Scientists (FAS) - a prestigious nuclear non-proliferation group - notes, "The United States first became aware of Dimona's existence [a nuclear facility in the southern Israeli town of the same name] after U-2 overflights in 1958 captured the facility's construction, but it was not identified as a nuclear site until two years later. The complex was variously explained as a textile plant, an agricultural station, and a metallurgical research facility, until David Ben-Gurion stated in December 1960 that [the] Dimona complex was a nuclear-research center built for 'peaceful purposes'." One should recall similar explanations that India proffered in the aftermath of its so-called peaceful nuclear explosion in 1974, and until it became a declared nuclear power in 1998. Iran is currently using the very same rationale to pursue its own nuclear program.

During the 1960s, the US sent nuclear inspectors to the Dimona nuclear facility seven times, but, according to the FAS, "they were unable to obtain an accurate picture of activities carried out there, largely due to tight Israeli control of the timing and agenda of the visits". The same source adds, "The Israelis went so far as to install false control-room panels and to brick over elevators and hallways that accessed certain areas of the facility. The inspectors were able to report that there was no clear scientific research or civilian nuclear-power program justifying such a large reactor - circumstantial evidence of the Israeli bomb program - but found no evidence of 'weapons-related activities' such as the existence of a plutonium-reprocessing plant." (Iraq used a similar campaign of deception to hide its own nuclear capabilities in the aftermath of the Gulf War of 1991.)

MORE AT ASIA TIMES JULY 10,2004

BTW Jim T, Pan is no trouble maker, he just likes to razz the bushbots who are completely impervious to truth.

US says world safer, despite 11,000 attacks in '05 By Caroline Drees, Security Correspondent
14 minutes ago

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The U.S. war on terrorism has made the world safer, the State Department's counterterrorism chief said on Friday, despite more than 11,000 terrorist attacks worldwide last year that killed 14,600 people.

The State Department said the numbers, listed in its annual Country Reports on Terrorism released on Friday, were based on a broader definition of terrorism and could not be compared to the 3,129 international attacks listed the previous year.

But the new 2005 figures, which showed attacks in Iraq jumped and accounted for about a third of the world's total, may fuel criticism of the Bush administration's assertion that it is winning the fight against terrorism
at yahoo news

At present, by not being able to talk about Israel's nuclear program, you can't talk about any aspect of arms control. The American viewpoint should be frankly to block proliferation regardless of what country is involved."

- Anthony Cordesman, Georgetown University professor in Voice of America, on May 5th, 2000.

Saladin, your question from the last thread. The Elamites, AFAIK, did not live within the borders of modern-day Iran. Whatever peoples did live there (Davidians?) were displaced long ago by Indoeuropean language speakers from the north, usually called Persians. The Persians themselves suffered another such invasion, by the Parthians. Alexander the Great ended that empire.

Irrespecitive of all that ancient history, the majority of the inhabitants of Iran view themselves curturally as Persians. There are minorities of course. Arabs in the southeast, Kurds (such as your namesake) to the northeast, and a few other small groups near the Caspian Sea.

David Corn, sorry to say, but most of your website users(left-wing nut jobs) think that 9/11 was some government conspiracy orchestrated by the Bush administration. So asking them about a movie based on the true story of 9/11, seems irrelevant!

bush couldn't orchestrate a grocery shopping trip much less 9/11.

Tongue firmly planted in cheek...

Saladin stands against 2000 years of Christian propaganda proclaiming:

Pan is no trouble maker

April 28, 2006
Steppingstone to War
House passes 'Iran Freedom Support Act'
by Justin Raimondo
It is "a steppingstone to war," said Rep. Dennis Kucinich, during the debate over the so-called Iran Freedom Support Act, and if this vote is any measure of the degree of congressional opposition to the looming prospect of war with Tehran, then we have a lot to worry about.

Only 21 members of the House stood up against the overwhelming bipartisan wave of support for the bill, which would impose economic sanctions on the Iranians –†and openly proclaims the goal of effecting "regime change." Rep. Ron Paul, a Texas Republican, said the bill reminds him of a 1998 congressional resolution –†the Iraq Liberation Act –†that paved the way for the Iraqi debacle. Yet most of the "antiwar" contingent in the House of Representatives caved and voted in favor, including Democrats John Conyers, Maxine Waters, Jack Murtha, Bernie Sanders, Barbara Lee, and Lynn Woolsey.

The bill was opposed by the Bush administration, which officially holds that diplomacy is the way to go on the Iranian nukes issue. Thus it was supported by many Democrats, including the voluble Tom Lantos (D-Calif.), a co-author of the bill along with Florida Republican Ileana Ros-Lehtinen. Passage is a major goal of AIPAC, Israel's premier lobbying organization in the U.S., which for the past two years has featured the alleged Iranian threat to America as its convention theme: this year's conclave featured a multimedia exhibit supposedly dramatizing how Iran is "pursuing nuclear weapons and how it can be stopped." As Middle East expert Trita Parsi, of the John Hopkins School for Advanced International Studies, put it: "I don't see any other major groups behind this legislation that have had any impact on it."

The Israelis have made no secret of their efforts to get Uncle Sam to launch an attack. If you guys don't, a number of Israeli officials have implied, then we will. This last, however, is an empty threat, as the Israelis don't have the military capacity to wipe out Iran's widely dispersed nuclear research facilities in a single blow, and, in any case, are more than likely to wait until the last possible moment before they take the unusual step of fighting their own war. After all, why should they, when the U.S. is perfectly willing to sacrifice American troops and treasure on the altar of Israel's alleged national security interests?

ANTIWAR.COM

Regardless of whether Iranians are considered Persian or Semite, to hear Israel constantly using that as a weapon is ridiculous, considering the fact that much of Israel is not made up of Semites either! I'm pretty sure the people who live in SE Iran are being lumped into the main anti-semite group as the rest.

good old flight93! that's the one that all the cel calls were made from (at an altitude of about 7miles at 500+ mph no less!) oh, and don't forget the brave karate fighter who rallied the passengers into attacking the highjackers, thus causing flight93's rapid plunge straight into the ground! weee! see it for yourselves:
HUNT THE BOEING! shanksville edition

nothing like the truth, right TimL?

Robert, you've got the jist of my name for Pan! That was pretty funny :-)

James, let's not forget how the pieces of that plane managed to spread out over 8 miles, while leaving almost no debris at the alleged crash sight. Who's the nutjob around here? Let's ROLL!

Breaking the Last Taboo
The United States of Israel?
By ROBERT FISK

Stephen Walt towers over me as we walk in the Harvard sunshine past Eliot Street, a big man who needs to be big right now (he's one of two authors of an academic paper on the influence of America's Jewish lobby) but whose fame, or notoriety, depending on your point of view, is of no interest to him. "John and I have deliberately avoided the television shows because we don't think we can discuss these important issues in 10 minutes. It would become 'J' and 'S', the personalities who wrote about the lobby - and we want to open the way to serious discussion about this, to encourage a broader discussion of the forces shaping US foreign policy in the Middle East."

"John" is John Mearsheimer, a political scientist at the University of Chicago. Walt is a 50-year-old tenured professor at the John F Kennedy School of Government at Harvard. The two men have caused one of the most extraordinary political storms over the Middle East in recent American history by stating what to many non-Americans is obvious: that the US has been willing to set aside its own security and that of many of its allies in order to advance the interests of Israel, that Israel is a liability in the "war on terror", that the biggest Israeli lobby group, Aipac (the American Israel Public Affairs Committee), is in fact the agent of a foreign government and has a stranglehold on Congress - so much so that US policy towards Israel is not debated there - and that the lobby monitors and condemns academics who are critical of Israel.

"Anyone who criticises Israel's actions or argues that pro-Israel groups have significant influence over US Middle East policy," the authors have written, "...stands a good chance of being labelled an anti-Semite. Indeed, anyone who merely claims that there is an Israeli lobby runs the risk of being charged with anti-Semitism ... Anti-Semitism is something no-one wants to be accused of." This is strong stuff in a country where - to quote the late Edward Said - the "last taboo" (now that anyone can talk about blacks, gays and lesbians) is any serious discussion of America's relationship with Israel.

at counterpunch

Free "Republicans for Voldemort" buttons at tramlaw.info!

oh and since today is 911 day here in conspiracyville, I'll take this opportunity to bring this quote to the attention::

The circumstantial evidence that gets overlooked is the fact that EVERYBODY agreed on the fact that there were no major aircraft structures evident at the Pentagon.

JAMIE MCINTYRE, Sr. Pentagon Correspondent

HUNT THE BOEING! pentagon edition

David hurries with: "...now that Bush has vowed action..."

Yeah, I feel some of the same relief now that Bush has declared "No Windfall Profit Tax"!

For about a day, I thought my party went totally bonkers with this $100 Rebate "bcd" (boy cow droppings)! At least my fearless (but Feared by the Left) is still sane in the face of $3/Gallon Gas!

Let's roll

Why is the flight recording classified? Why are the parts strewn over 8 miles? How did passengers make cell phone calls?

It's pretty much settled or fairly obvious Cheney ordered the plane shot down but feared the impact of the truth on the industry so what do we get?

More lies. What's a lie versus the good of the country?

Let's roll.

PS to #20

"my fearless" stands for GWB; alternatively, add the word `Leader' if you are disagreeable with `GWB'.

David quips: "Here's a conversation starter: anyone out there looking forward to seeing the new film United 93?"

For now, I don't plan on seeing this movie but I am curious as to how it will be received. Some things are better left to the imaginations; rather than having visual images of actors/actress performing conjectured actions. I DO honor and applaud the heroisms of the passengers & crew of #93.

Not really. But I hope to hear the entire national anthem as sung in Spanish. Perhaps the neighborhood would like to hear it as well.

It must be so pleasant to inhabit the fantasy world of the bushbots, where the USA is always the hero pitted against all the evildoers of the world, and cell phones calls are perfectly reasonable at 35,000 feet. Whatever it is you're smoking, please don't pass it around.

Bush blasts Spanish national anthem...

Link at rawstory, it brought to mind the thought of the song at maximum volume, but...

But I hope to hear the entire national anthem as sung in Spanish.

Maybe Pande could help us out here. Why did the change the words in the Spanish version? Did they not translate well, word-for-word, in Spanish, or did change them on purpose?
I heard it sung last night, and it was a white guy producer.
*the other Alan

My oh my... Those were sky phones, not cell phones.
In 2001 use of cell phones in airplanes was both in violation of the law and usually impossible.

An interpretation of 2001 Sep 11 based on actual physics will be found at

www.geocities.com/debunking911/links.htm

which is quite thoroughly edited for accurate content, including something akin to peer review.

Lies, and coverups are the legacy that shrub will leave when finally his curtain comes down. Can't be too soon for me.

#24: "...whatever you're smoking, please don't pass it around." Don't worry, Sal, they won't. Only left-wing pinko socialist types share things. ;)
I must go off to mine salt now.--KC

April 28, 2006 -- UNITED NATIONS -- The U.S. ambassador to the United Nations said Friday that the United States will seek a resolution in the Security Council urging Iran to halt its nuclear ambitions. "Diplomacy is my first choice" for dealing with Iran, said President Bush.

April 31, 2006 -- WASHINGTON -- The Pentagon for the first revealed details of its new "bunker-buster" nuclear weaponry, known in military circles as Diplomacy missiles.

oh they were all skyphones? good that clears that up! it's too bad that there's no wreckage in the photos that they released of the crater - a crater, I might add, that's about 10' x 10' - I've dug bigger holes with a shovel - but I'm sure that everything about the official fairytale is kosher and has held up to scrutiny! yup, no doubt about it!

Eggman, is that the same bunker buster that hit the Pentagon on 9/11, except with a nuke on board?

Nuestro Himno

ps - I like Hendrix' version better, but that's just my opinion...

So James , we outta go see 93 and view it like we would Shrek 3. The largest piece of debris was the flight recorder and it wasn't in the crater, it landed all on its own somewhere else.

I saw Gore on TV last night on an episode of South Park. They get all the celebs like Jesus and Al Gore and Chef.

Those were sky phones, not cell phones.

Thanks Professor Benson, for pointing that out. I have before myself, but there's friends on here that don't want to see it that way. Here's another article that brings it up too.

'Let's roll...'

For they are also the words that closed a remarkable conversation on 11 September between a man called Todd Beamer and Lisa Jefferson, a telephone switchboard operator. The words are: 'Let's Roll'.
Jefferson was in a suburb of Chicago, at the headquarters of the GTE phone company, when she took the call that, she now says, changed her life. Beamer, the caller, was aboard the hijacked and doomed United Airlines Flight 93 from Newark to San Francisco.

(snip)

Somebody else chokes. Shortly afterwards, both pilots were seen lying motionless on the floor just outside the first-class curtain - they had had their throats cut, according to one passenger. Within six minutes, UA Flight 93 had changed course and was heading for Washington.

(another snip)

Those on board, destined for destruction, relayed their final words of love and farewells over digital airwaves - and thereby into indelible technological posterity. The phone calls began, 23 from airphones, others by mobile, with passengers passing their cell phones to strangers. Through these calls those aboard UA93 learnt what was happening to America that morning.

(one last snip)

Todd Beamer's call to airphone operator Lisa Jefferson was, she says, a turning point in her life. 'I will play it over and over in my mind,' she says.
======================
Did all those people make this up? Did the big conspiracy pay them off too? A conspiracy of thousands! And it went off like clockwork, not like the Iraq War, Katrina, and every other fkn thing bushco touches.
My fav theory of the absurd is... hologram of planes. Yikes! It'd be much easier to alter some film or still shots and make the conspiracy buffs believe it, than project holograms. Dontcha think?
Please you guys, we know what you think, but repeating it over and over on here won't change anybody's mind, and you're preaching amongst yourselves.
Sorry, but that wastes as much bandwidth as the trolls, and nobody has changed their minds either.

IF MAN WILL NOT LEARN FROM HISTORY, HE IS DESTINED TO RELIVE IT.

From the Rush Limbaugh program last Thursday - 4/6/06:

"I want to call this proposal the Limbaugh Laws.

Here they are.

First, if you immigrate to the United States of America, you must speak the native language.

You have to be a professional or an investor. We are not going to take unskilled workers. You will not be allowed.

There will be no special bilingual programs in the schools, no special ballots for elections, no government business will be conducted in your native language.

Foreigners will not have the right to vote, I don't care how long they are here, nor will they ever be allowed to hold political office.

According to the Limbaugh Laws, if you're in our country, you cannot be a burden to taxpayers. You are not entitled, ever, to welfare, to food stamps, or other government goodies.

You can come if you invest here, but it must be an amount equal to 40,000 times the daily minimum wage. If you don't know have that amount of money, you can't come and invest. You have to stay home.

If you do come and you want to buy land, okay, but we're going to restrict your options. You will not be allowed to buy waterfront property in the United States. That will be reserved for citizens naturally born in this country.

In fact, as a foreigner, you must relinquish individual rights to property.

These are the Limbaugh Laws.

Another thing.

You don't have the right to protest when you come here. You're allowed no demonstrations, you cannot wave a foreign flag, no political
organizing, no bad-mouthing our president or his policies, or you get sent home. You're a
foreigner. You shut your mouth or you get out, andif you come here illegally, you go straight to jail and we're going to hunt you down 'til we find you.

I can imagine many of you think that the Limbaugh Laws are pretty harsh. I imagine today some of you probably are going, "Yeah! Yeah!"
Well, let me tell you this, folks.

Every one of the laws I just mentioned are actual laws of Mexico, today. I just read you Mexican immigration law."

Damn, no wonder the Mexicans are invading our country.

oh well I guess if the official transcripts say it then it must be so! - jeez louise! whatever was I thinking? -

oh the official transcripts forgot something though....passenger mark bingham, (whose memorial website markbingham.com popped up on 9/12/01) who uttered that now famous line "hello mom? this is mark bingham!" on a sky phone, was inadvertently left off the 'official' passenger list. these are the same 'official' lists that for the last 5 years didn't include any highjacker names until the mooseowie trial, where a revised 'official' passenger list was brought forth as incriminating evidence - with suddenly added highjacker's names, but without mark bingham's name - oops!
oh well, if we ignore it then it didn't happen!

I could go on all day - if you'd rather that I didn't, you'd better cease making excuses for the myriad discrepancies in the govts fairytale -

Excerpted from:

Immigration Flood Unleashed by NAFTA
By Roger Bybee and Carolyn Winter
t r u t h o u t | Perspective
Thursday 27 April 2006

While there has been some media coverage of NAFTA's ruinous impact on US industrial communities, there has been even less media attention paid to its catastrophic effects in Mexico:

NAFTA, by permitting heavily-subsidized US corn and other agri-business products to compete with small Mexican farmers, has driven Mexican farmers off the land due to low-priced imports of US corn and other agricultural products. Some 2 million Mexicans have been forced out of agriculture, and many of those that remain are living in desperate poverty. These people are among those that cross the border to feed their families. (Meanwhile, corn-based tortilla prices climbed by 50%. No wonder so many Mexican peasants have called NAFTA their "death warrant.")

NAFTA's service-sector rules allowed big firms like Wal-Mart to enter the Mexican market and, selling low-priced goods made by ultra-cheap labor in China, to displace locally-based shoe, toy, and candy firms. An estimated 28,000 small and medium-sized Mexican businesses have been eliminated.

Wages along the Mexican border have actually been driven down by about 25% since NAFTA, reported a Carnegie Endowment study. An over-supply of workers, combined with the government-sponsored crushing of union organization, has resulted in sweatshop pay along the border where wages now typically run 60 cents to $1 an hour.

So rather than improving living standards, Mexican wages have actually fallen since NAFTA. The initial growth in the number of jobs has leveled off, with China's even more repressive labor system luring US firms to locate there instead.

But Mexicans must still contend with the results of the American-owned "maquiladora" sweatshops: subsistence-level wages, pollution, congestion, horrible living conditions (cardboard shacks and open sewers), and a lack of resources (for streetlights and police) to deal with a wave of violence against vulnerable young women working in the factories. The survival (or less)-level wages coupled with harsh working conditions have not been the great answer to Mexican poverty, while they have temporarily been the answer to Corporate America's demand for low wages.

More.

**************************

A repost, but timely.

What You Won't See in Flight 93, the Film Sobering. By JAMES RIDGEWAY The only people to defend the United States on 911 were the passengers and crews of the 4 hijacked planes. The President and the Secretary of Defense, the two top officials in the chain of command responsible for defense the country were out of commission. Dick Cheney, the vice president, who under the constitution has no authority to issue orders, was running the country from the White House bunker. The FAA and the military were nowhere. On Flight 11, flight attendants Betty Ong and Amy Sweeney were on the phone to American Airlines ground personnel minutes after the hijacking began. Even though both the FAA and the airlines had been warned more than 50 times in the months preceding the attack, officials on the ground reacted with skepticism an annoyance to Betty Ong’s desperate call. According to one account by people who have listened to all the tapes, American Airlines people were anxious to keep what was going on secret. An American Airlines tape, according to Gail Sheehy in the New York Observer, shows the managers were concerned about keeping things secret. People who listened to the tapes said there were statements including the following: "Keep it close,’’ "keep it quiet’’, "Let’s keep this among ourselves.’’ So in those terrifying minutes before the first hit, two brave women on the phone inside Flight 11 were calmly telling American Airlines ground officials exactly what was happening. The airline’s reaction: Nothing. It did absolutely nothing. The managers could have picked up a phone and told all their pilots what was going on. Indeed they co told all pilots in the air what was happening. They could have called officials in New York. There is a real likelihood people at least could have evacuated the second tower. If someone on the ground had acted, Flight 93, sitting on the Newark airport tarmac, might well have avoided the hijack. Flight 93 took off at 8:42 that morning, a few minutes before the Flight 11 struck the WTC. It was not hijacked until 9:28. It is simple fact that the FAA, American Airlines and the military knew about the 911 hijacking before Flight 93 took off. Before its cockpit was seized two planes had hit the World Trade Center. The 911 Commission report states it clearly: “As news of the hijackings filtered through the FAA and the airlines, it does not seem to have occurred to their leadership that they needed to alert other aircraft in the air that they too might be at risk.’’ The 911 Commission found ``no evidence…that American Airlines ever sent any cockpit warnings to its aircraft on 911.’’ United’s first decisive move to inform its pilots occurred at 9:19 when a United Flight dispatcher, on his own initiative, notified the airline’s intercontinental flights: “Beware any cockpit intrusion. Two a/c [aircraft] hit World Trade Center.’’ Flight 93 got this warning at 9:24. Two minutes later the pilot responded and asked for confirmation. And two minutes later flight controllers in Cleveland heard shouts from the cockpit: “Hey get out of here ... get out of here ... get out of here.’’ The pilot had heard the warning, but had not had time to react. The only people who were aware of the earlier hijackings that day and used their knowledge to take decisive and effective action were the passengers on Flight 93.

First, if you immigrate to the United States of America, you must speak the native language.

Every one of the laws I just mentioned are actual laws of Mexico, today. I just read you Mexican immigration law...

Anybody else spot a small inconsistancy here.

Nahhhh, I have something much more fun to talk about.
Anyone care to guess who said this: "You and I both know that our democracy can thrive only when the people’s voice is heard and when their questions are answered."

I didn't imagine that you would be able to guess. Why, it was that great patriot Bill Frist...Yes, he believes, according to his statement in an email, that democracy can only thrive when people's questions are answered. That is why, of course, he did everything in his power to protect the administration from having to answer any questions about the lead up to the invasion, the response to hurricanes, the spying on Americans and the plethora of other little items that might embarrass it...or alternatively, protect our very democratic republic.
Gug

Mirrored `Fun' Image of #24

It must be so pleasant to inhabit the conspiracy world of the unbushbots, where the USA is always the villain pitted against all the dogooders of the world, and GTE skyphones don't work at 35,000 feet. Whatever it is you're smoking, please pass it around.

another thing that you won't see in Flight 93 by JAMES RIDGEWAY, is that a search of the flight records for that day reveal that neither flight11 nor flight77 left the ground on 9/11/01.

James, what happened to all those passengers then?

but it's easier to just laugh at others and bandy derogatory terms about than to actually suspect that our fearless leaders would lie, even though it's easy to look things up for oneself.

http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0427-29.htm

Not everyone is laughing

chigirl, how would I know? but one thing I do know is that there was a 911 survivors fund or whatever, for families of 911 victims, and the families of the dead in the towers have for the most part claimed it, but the families of the dead in the planes have for the most part NOT claimed it. and many of the dead in the planes are not listed in the SS death index either. what does that mean? I don't know, but many people suspect that most of the passenger names were fabricated. - out of 4 supposedly highjacked airliners that day, there were barely enough passengers to fill even 1 airliner -
now I'm done with 911 for the day because :
if we ignore it then it never happened.

I know you're not laughing chigirl - by the way, stay away from the silverstein/sears tower on the 2nd - 4th.

Nutty. Well, it's happy hour and I for one, shall ignore it for just a wee bit longer. Shameful, I know.

Of May? Why? What's up woth those dates? I don't work all that near there. How far away is enough?

Waht are you plotting James?

geof01 #32

You're joking of course. There was no bomb at the Pentagon. In fact, there is no Pentagon. It's a hologram beamed from an Israeli satellite to cover up an al-Qaeda training facility run by John F. Kennedy, whose "death" in 1963 was actually filmed on the same soundstage as the Moon landings. It's all so obvious!

OK, I kid the black-helicopter conspiracy buffs, but I have to admit that I have never heard a plausible answer for why United 93's debris was scattered over such a large area. Or why NORAD was AWOL that day. So count me as "undecided."

[First, if you immigrate to the United States of America, you must speak the native language.]

Which one is that? Cherokee? Sioux? Anastasi?

there's a "terror alert" drill scheduled for chicago beginning on may 2 - and as 911 and london 7/7 have both shown us, "terror alert" drills have a nasty habit of becoming days of actual terror. plus, larry silverstein has purchased the lease for the sears tower, just as he did for the wtc - and it's obvious what became of that.

#47 Thanks ChiGirl, that was a good article.
The only thing I seen that he didn't touch on, was that WTC #7 was built on a 'scaffold' on top of an existing Con-Ed power station.
*electricity melts steel faster than thermite

ABC World News Tonight is saying Rush got busted today. Script charges for his pills.

Eggman, that would explain why the the clearest image on google earth is that of the pentagon.

Chigirl, if you believe James or not, I would definitely stay away from downtown next week.

There were drills in New York and London on the days of the attacks and after that all of the evidence is missing or classified.

Denial is spending $8 to watch a fictionalized account of Flight 93 and ignoring "911 Loose Change" and "In Plane Truth" which are free and blame no one, just seek the answers.

49

...now I'm done with 911 for the day....

Posted by: James Ha at April 28, 2006 05:59 PM
=========================================
56

.... and as 911 and london 7/7 have both shown us....

Posted by: James Ha at April 28, 2006 06:19 PM
==========================================

My, James, What are YOU smoooooking? Your "day" is really, really short TODAY, what, all of 20 Minutes!

a 47 story skyscraper was built on a scaffold? oh no wonder it imploded into it's own footprint in less than 10 seconds - that explains that!

wtc7.net

wow that WAS all of 20 minutes wasn't it?
thanx hap, no wonder I'm all worn out already!
ok, I'm truly done this time, I promise.
last one: aluminum plane, steel building

In 2001, Bush family consigliore, James Baker, presented a report to the powerful Council on Foreign Relations which found that "a new era of energy scarcity was upon the world, presenting fundamental obstacles to continued growth and prosperity." (Lawrence Shoup "The CFR Debates Torture" Z Magazine March 2006)

Baker's conclusions resulted in the formation of the White House Energy Policy Development Group headed by Dick Cheney. This was the secretive group of oil executives which divided up Iraq's enormous oil reserves before the first bomb was dropped. The plan was clearly endorsed by American elites at the CFR who must have known the WMD-scare was a ruse from the very beginning.

The Biggest Gas Station On Earth

a 47 story skyscraper was built on a scaffold?

yep, they laid a 'bridge' across the existing columns of the power station and built 7 on top of it. Bridge/scaffold, whatever you wanna call it. I've sent you the links. It's true.
Short version of my 'theory' is... main trunk lines feeding the towers were dead shorts going right back to those transformers under 7.
With xformers blowing and all hell breaking loose in the plant... yeah, i can see it undermining the very support system holding that building up. Said yourself it fell from the bottom up. As for aluminum vs steel, you'd have to get into the scientific formulas for mass x velocity, against stationary lighter mass beams. Only takes common sense to see the answer to that.
Now, I'm with you, that's it for 9/11 for today. I'm sure I'll have to defend something from Sal later when she chimes in. Go for it my friend, but I might not reply.

Rush Limbaugh arrested on prescription drug charges

MarketWatch -- Radio talk show host Rush Limbaugh has been arrested on prescription drug charges, according to a media report today. The warrant was for fraud to conceal information to obtain a prescription.

D.Benson, so I suppose that Barbara Olson, who reportedly locked herself in the bathroom, took one of the sky phones with her? And if they meant sky phones, why did they say cell phones? Also, how on earth did they manage to record these calls, were the family members all set, just in case their loved ones plane got hijacked? It was also very thoughtful of the hijackers to pack everything that would be needed to identify themselves, and then put all that paperwork in their CHECKED luggage, where someone was bound to find it after the planes had been destroyed. I do know that DNA survives a fire that melts an entire 757, but only if it crashes in DC, if it crashes in NY, no DNA survives, but passports come out unscathed!
Alan, your attempt to censor our 9/11 comments is out of line. Why do you think anyone is trying to change your mind? I'm under the impression that the majority of regulars here, and quite a few passersby, do not believe that govt. hogwash story. Saying it is a waste of bandwidth is your opinion, I think endless comments about delay are a waste, but I've not said so until now. Go check out the Universal website, look at what most of the people are saying about that stupid movie. You are becoming part of a quickly growing minority, people are waking up, and the sooner the better.

well if I hadn't already promised not to bring it up again I might say that ol' larry silverstein must be a fool to've built his new and improved wtc7 on the exact same scaffold that the old one was built on - maybe he's doubled his scaffold ins. just like he doubled his terror attack ins. right before that fateful day.

Alan, I just saw your comment. I've told you that I'm not going to debate this subject with you anymore. My only objection is your comment about this subject wasting bandwidth. That is David's call, not yours. My advice is for you to scroll past all those annoying 9/11 comments, just like you would any troll,'kay?

Re #66: Yes. Sky phones are cordless. Who says they said 'cell phones'? A disinformation site? And perhaps, they did not know enough to recognize the different technology involved.

Go to the 911 myths site to see a sane perspective. With regard to the events of 2001 Sep 11, are you familiar with the term 'SNAFU'?

Aw, #65, you beat me to it. I was hoping to share that news with his devotee, LBH. Couldn't happen to a nicer guy.

I like it when James sites a series of facts about any one of the parts of 9/11, whether its about WTC1 or 2 or about AA93 or about the insurance fund or about forensics at the pentagon, or facts about the anthrax letters or about the forged national guard memos that ended up and CBS weeks before the election or the forged niger documents. Theories such as hologram airplanes are less intersting in my humble opinion.

Alan, your attempt to censor our 9/11 comments is out of line.

I guess it did sound like censoring. Sorry 'bout that. It's just that posting the same links and making the same arguments over and over gets old. I realize tho, that it's actually the topic of David's post today, so... my bad.

I think endless comments about delay are a waste, but I've not said so until now.

Ya mean Tom Delay? I'm not sure I follow you. Have I posted too much about him? Sorry, but if I posted about him, I hope it was a new development of an ongoing corruption case.

Rove's Legal Troubles More Extensive Than Previously Reported

It has been widely reported that Rove's legal troubles center around his initial failure to tell prosecutors about his conversation with TIME Magazine's Matt Cooper regarding Joe Wilson's wife. In a new story, Murray Waas reports that Rove could also be in legal jeopardy based on the substance of what he said about his conversation with Cooper once he acknowledged it occurred.

Here's the critical point:

Rove testified to the grand jury that when he told Cooper that Plame worked at the agency, he was only passing along unverified gossip, according to people familiar with his testimony.

In contrast, Cooper has testified that Rove told him in a phone conversation on July 11, 2003, that Plame worked for the CIA and played a role in having the agency select her husband, former Ambassador Joseph C. Wilson, to make a fact-finding trip to Niger in 2002.

Cooper has also testified that Rove, as well as a second source I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, then-chief of staff to Vice President Dick Cheney portrayed the information about Plame as accurate and authoritative.

So there is a big difference between Rove's version of the story and Cooper's version of the story. If Fitzgerald establishes that Rove is the one not telling the truth, it could potentially form the basis of perjury or obstruction of justice charges against Rove.

In short: Rove's in even more trouble than we thought.

*****end of clip*****

More trouble than we thought, eh? I wonder if Busheney are more desperate than we thought?

capt

Don,

Is their some poster here that quotes Limbaugh? Unbelievable. Limbaugh is the far right rhetoric machine. He so full of sh^t. I couldn?t take ten minutes of his extremist rants before he got hooked the brain-deluding pain killers. Do you ever feel sorry for the extreme right? All their heroes are going down in flames. It must be a little depressing.

wow 911myths! here's their oh-so-qualifying self qualification:

We’re not about debunking entire conspiracies, then, but will use this site to zoom in on what we think are the more dubious stories, revealing the misquotes, the distortions, the inaccuracies that are so common online.

a pity really, since the govt. fairytale was the 1st conspiracy theory to get started. just because these guys claim to be the last word about inaccuracies doesn't make them so.

Does anyone know if thermite is used in demolition charges? Have you seen the thermite demo video on google? That'll open your eyes!

Sun's going down on this side of 'Merica... Just finished puttin up the mower, the brush-bladed Weed Wacker...also fixed the last part of the fence. The new naaaaybors down the hill were quite surprised that the "welcome wagon" consisted of 5 dogs, 2 little goats and a VERY vocal mini-donkey who's "begging for crackers" braying sounds like a Tyranosaurus on speed!

Anyhoo...no real news from Spank...still scheduled to move, full-time patrols in Tal Afar for now. Anybody still planning on sending candy packages should go ahead. His APO will find him even if he moves.

A special thanks to those who've already sent something. I didn't talk to him, but Jill did and he's gotten a couple boxes he was kinda afraid to open, at first. I e-mailed him to expect some from people he doesn't know.

Jill's off at her Mom's in Durham, NC. Throwing some kind of Lacross party or something, I think.

I've got "Good Night and Good Luck" and "The Weatherman", a rack of Sierra Nevada PA (still lookin' for the NEW IPA, Saladin!) a couple ribeyes (one for me, one for the children) and a beautiful 80-degree day, cooling to 55 tonight.

Oh, btw...When I met my buddy Gus, for a ski trip near Shanksville in March '01, many of the locals at Seven Springs resort were having lively debates about Flight 93 and whether or not it was shot down. Much talk about the finding of debris in a lake over 5 miles from the impact site...

More questions that need answering, but anybody asking them seem to get "swiftboated" or just ignored.

....sigh...

-t

Iran-Israel Linkage By Bush Seen As Threat

Jewish leaders warn of backlash as president cites Jewish state as rationale for possible strikes.

President Bush is risking a backlash that could injure the Jewish community and his own cause by repeatedly citing Israel as his top rationale for possible U.S. military conflict with Iran, Jewish leaders and Middle East analysts warned this week.

Bush's repeated, sometimes exclusive, focus on Israel could spark public fury against the Jewish state and Jews if U.S. military action is accompanied by skyrocketing gas prices, terrorism at home or fallen G.I.'s who might be seen as dying for Israel, some said. Others feared it could fracture the shaky international coalition Bush is striving to assemble to oppose Iran's nuclear program by framing the threat as primarily to Israel rather than international stability.

Ambassador Edward Walker, a former U.S. envoy to Israel who now heads the Middle East Institute in Washington, termed Bush's Israel focus "a terrible idea."

"Just think about if gas prices go up to $7 a gallon as a result, and everybody is saying it's because of Israel," he said.

More HERE

*****end of clip*****

An interesting piece.

capt

"Since world war two we've managed to create history's first truly global empire. This has been done by the corporatocracy, which are a few men and women who run our major corporations and in doing so also run the U.S. government and many other governments around the world." John Perkins, 2005, author of the book titled ' Confessions of and Economic Hit Man'

=
The civilized have created the wretched, quite coldly and deliberately, and do not intend to change the status quo; are responsible for their slaughter and enslavement; rain down bombs on defenseless children whenever and wherever they decide that their "vital interests" are menaced, and think nothing of torturing a man to death: these people are not to be taken seriously when they speak of the "sanctity" of human life, or the "conscience" of the civilized world: James Baldwin - Source: page 489 of COLLECTED ESSAYS (1998), from chapter one of "The Devil Finds Work" (orig. pub. 1976)

===

Thanks ICH Newsletter!

Yes D. Benson, here are two claims from the famous disinfo site known as CNN

CeeCee Lyles of Fort Myers, Florida, was a flight attendant. She reached her husband, Lorne, by cell phone to tell him that she loved him and their children before the plane went down. The couple between them had four children.

Jeremy Glick, 31, from West Milford, New Jersey, called his wife, Liz, and in-laws in New York on a cell phone to tell them the plane had been hijacked, Joanne Makely, Glick's mother-in-law, told CNN. Glick said that one of the hijackers "had a red box he said was a bomb, and one had a knife of some nature," Makely said. Glick asked Makely if the reports about the attacks on the World Trade Center were true, and she told him they were. He left the phone for a while, returning to say, "The men voted to attack the terrorists," Makely said.

And another good disinfo site called Post Gazette.com said this:

With him were others who placed cell-phone calls from the plane, Jeffery Glick, 31, a sales manager for a technology firm, Thomas Burnett Jr., 38, a California businessman, and Mark Bingham, 31, a former college rugby player from California. Beamer mentioned Glick by his first name in the call to Jefferson, Lisa Beamer said.

So, when did the news change the claim from cell phone to air phone? And if they never said cell phone why has this controversy over cell phones at 35,000 feet been raging for the past 5 years? Also, why did the people in charge of the tape recordings between the pilots and ground control decide it was necessary to shred the tapes and drop the pieces in various trash cans around the building? And what about the thousand other holes that Alan describes as a perfect set-up and execution? Why won't they let us see the pentagon tapes? Why are Sibel Edmonds and dozens of firemen and police officers under gag orders not to talk about the events of 9/11? Why are the family members who are bringing a lawsuit against the airlines and security companies in charge on 9/11 also under gag orders not to talk? What is up with all this secrecy? Perfectly innocent matters of state security I suppose, right?

I read (years ago) that Thermite is basically iron rust and aluminum filings. It takes a very high temp to start it - I believe they said they use a strip of magnesium.

This was from a "Anarchists Cookbook" and might not be bona fide or complete. Nasty stuff though, they said it will burn through most everything.

capt

Yes Alan, I was referring to tom delay, I think he is boring, boring, boring, I think quite a lot of the partisan rhetoric on this blog is a boring waste, but I would not say, "stop wasting bandwidth with all this blather" because I realize that everyone has their own priorities about what is important, as it should be. To me, 9/11 is of the utmost importance because of how bushco and most of congress whore it out to keep us terrified of some illusional boogeyman in order to justify all manner of murder and plunder on innocent people. You have every right to believe what you want, as well as say what you want, and so do we. As I said, if our comments annoy you, don't read them.

18 rich families pay for campaign to kill estate taxes

Washington -- Eighteen of America's wealthiest families, including the Timkens of Canton, are bankrolling efforts to permanently repeal estate taxes that would save their families a total of $71.6 billion, according to a report released Tuesday by public interest groups.

Groups funded by the super-rich have engaged in a deceptive campaign to convince the public that estate taxes cause widespread problems for small businesses and family farms when they actually affect about one in 370 estates, said the report released by Public Citizen and Boston-based United for a Fair Economy.

This year, all assets under $2 million for individuals and under $4 million for couples are exempt from estate taxes. Current tax law will boost those exemptions to $3.5 million and $7 million in 2009, eliminate the estate tax in 2010, and reimpose it in 2011 with a $1 million exemption.

More HERE

*****end of clip*****

I wonder if the 18 families are related other than being American bluebloods. (I am assuming they are Americans)

capt

Saladin, they are called sky phones, not 'air' phones. As I said, perhaps the people involved, including reporters, did not know these use a different technology.

Please give me a news story in a reputable publication which states that ground control recordings were destroyed. I believe that is an actionable offense.

The firemen, and perhaps others, were already interviewed. You can read all they had to say shortly after 2001 Sep 11 on fireman.com. A synopsis should be available on the debunking 911 site. If not available, I'll arrange for the webmaster to oblige me, and thus you.

Have to leave now. Back tomorrow.

Hajji, if you can get the SN Pale, you may be able to have your market special order the IPA. It's worth a try!
Capt, I watched that thermite video, the guys were running a fuse into a clay flower pot full of thermite, sitting on top of a car hood, then lighting it. It actually turned the metal into liquid in about 10 seconds, really amazing stuff. The hot spots and molten iron in the basements of all three towers weeks later are still a mystery, they sure as hell weren't caused by electric fires!

D. Benson, is this reputable enough for you?

F.A.A. Official Scrapped Tape of 9/11 Controllers' Statements

NY Times| May 6 2004

At least six air traffic controllers who dealt with two of the hijacked airliners on Sept. 11, 2001, made a tape recording that day describing the events, but the tape was destroyed by a supervisor without anyone making a transcript or even listening to it, the Transportation Department said today.

The taping began before noon on Sept. 11 at the New York Air Route Traffic Control Center, in Ronkonkoma, on Long Island, but it was later destroyed by an F.A.A. quality-assurance manager, who crushed the cassette in his hand, cut the tape into little pieces and dropped them in different trash cans around the building, according to a report made public today by the inspector general of the Transportation Department.

The inspector general had been asked by Senator John McCain, chairman of the Senate Commerce Committee, to look into how well the Federal Aviation Administration had cooperated with the 9/11 Commission.

The quality-assurance manager told investigators that he had destroyed the tape because he thought making it was contrary to F.A.A. policy, which calls for written statements, and because he felt that the controllers "were not in the correct frame of mind to have properly consented to the taping" because of the stress of the day.

Another official, the center's manager, asked the controllers to make the tape because "he wanted a contemporaneous recordation of controller accounts to be immediately available for law enforcement," according to the report, and was concerned that the controllers would take a leave of absence immediately, which is standard procedure after a crash.

On the tape, the controllers, some of whom had spoken by radio to people on the planes and some who had tracked the aircraft on radar, gave statements of 5 to 10 minutes each, according to the report.

The center manager had agreed with the president of the local union chapter that the tapes would be destroyed once the standard written statements were obtained, the report said.

Neither the center manager nor the quality-assurance manager disclosed the tape's existence to their superiors at the F.A.A. region that covers New York, or to the agency's Washington headquarters, according to the report.

None of the officials or controllers were identified in the report.
-----------
That is the lamest excuse for destroying vital evidence that I have ever heard!

Home foreclosures increase 72%

IRVINE, Calif. -- Mortgages entering foreclosure jumped 72 percent during the first quarter from a year earlier, as higher interest rates increased monthly payments and strained the budgets of homeowners with adjustable-rate loans.

Lenders began foreclosing on 323,102 mortgages, a ratio of one in 358 U.S. households, according to a report issued Monday by RealtyTrac Inc. Banks typically start foreclosing on mortgages after payments are 90 days late.

"When you couple the higher bills that people with adjustable loans saw with the higher-than-expected energy costs, you see a lot of homeowners stretched beyond the point where they could make their payments," said Rick Sharga, a RealtyTrac vice president.

Homeowners who would otherwise sell their houses to pay off their loans face a weaker market, he said.

Sales of existing homes fell to 6.71 million at an annualized rate in the first quarter from 6.94 million in the last three months of 2005, according to Fannie Mae, the nation's largest mortgage buyer.

*****end of clip*****

The new paradigm does nothing for real people.

capt

Re #86: Wow, Saladin, that was fast on your part! I don't know how you do it. Thank you very much as the people working on improving the debunking 911 site need this.

Saladin and capt: Yes, thermite is rust and powdered aluminum. Burns into smoke and pure iron. No pure iron found at any WTC site. No molten metal found at any WTC site. Yellow hot steel, yes. But none molten. My explaination for the yellow hot steel should be on the debunking 911 site. The physics of it was simple enough for me to work it out.

Now, after a delay, I really must leave, but I once again thank Saladin for her prompt reply!

And you are wrong about rescue workers being under gag orders. It's true some were interviewed, but others had this to say:

NYC Cops, Firemen Report 'Bombs Inside WTC"
American Free Press

NEW YORK CITY, N.Y.--On the morning of Sept. 11, 2005, New York City auxiliary fire lieutenant Paul Isaac Jr. asserted: I know 9-11 was an inside job. The police know it's an inside job; and the firemen know it too. He also added, after pointing to throngs of police officers standing around us, that, we all have to be very careful about how we handle it.

Isaac reiterated what a 9-11 survivor told this journalist during our protest at Ground Zero on Sept. 11, 2005 -- that emergency radios were buzzing with information about bombs being detonated inside the World Trade Center towers.

People are afraid to talk for fear of retaliation or losing their jobs, said Isaac, referring to the FBI gag order placed on law enforcement and fire department officials, preventing them from openly talking about any inside knowledge of 9-11. First-hand evidence from individuals who were on the scene [suggest] that the World Trade Center towers were brought down not by the airliner's impact or the resulting jet fuel fires, but instead by a deliberately executed controlled demolition.

Researcher Vincent Sammartino, who was also at the WTC on the afternoon of September 11, 2005, wrote the following on the American Free Press Web site: I just got back from Ground Zero. People know the truth. Half of the police and firemen were coming up to us and telling us that they know that 9-11 was an inside job. They were told not to talk about it.... I had tears in my eyes.

So many secrets kept hidden about the most overt attack on the US since Pearl Harbor:

NEW
YORK COURT CENSORS TESTIMONIES OF 911

(1) denied the motion of nine family members
of persons who died on 9/11 for leave to intervene as petitioners
(Family Members), and

(2) directed disclosure of the oral histories albeit redacted to delete
the employees' personal expressions of feelings, opinions and recommendations.

Not falling within the intra-agency exception are the personal expressions of feelings contained in the oral histories, and we accordingly
modify to direct disclosure of such expressions.

In other words, if a firefighter who was interviewed said, "I heard what sounded like explosions and I think it was bombs that took
down those towers, it was all so horrible", the press will merely get the portion that says: "it was all so horrible".

There is more..

(3) directed disclosure of the 911 tapes and
transcripts albeit redacted to delete the opinions and recommendations of respondent's employees, and further redacted to delete the words of 911 callers other than those related to the Family Members, unanimously modified, on the law, to grant the motion to intervene, and to direct disclosure of respondent's employees' personal expressions of feeling
contained in the oral histories, and otherwise affirmed, without costs.

Translation for you non-lawyer types: The transcripts of tapes of the calls that people made to 911 on that day will not be released at all because the Court said they would invade the privacy of the surviving families - even though surviving family members indicated to the Court
that they waived such rights to privacy.

There is one higher court in New York that this decision could be appealed to, the Court of Appeals, but I have seen no reports on whether the New York Times plans on appealing it. These same records will not even make it to the 9-11 Commission without deletions.
---------------
Secrets, secrets, secrets.

Excuse me? No molten iron was found at any WTC sight? How odd, that's not what Peter Tully, president of Tully Construction of Flushing, N.Y., told AFP:

...he saw pools of literally molten steel at the World Trade Center.

Tully was contracted after the Sept. 11 tragedy to re move the debris from the site.

Tully called Mark Loizeaux, president of Controlled Demolition, Inc. (CDI) of Phoenix, Md., for consultation about removing the debris. CDI calls itself the innovator and global leader in the controlled demolition and implosion of structures.

Loizeaux, who cleaned up the bombed Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City, arrived at the WTC site two days later and wrote the clean-up plan for the entire operation.

AFP asked Loizeaux about the report of molten steel on the site.

yes, he said, hot spots of molten steel in the basements.
These incredibly hot areas were found at the bottoms of the elevator shafts of the main towers, down seven [basement] levels, Loizeaux said.

The molten steel was found three, four, and five weeks later, when the rubble was being removed, Loizeaux said. He said molten steel was also found at 7 WTC, which collapsed mysteriously in the late afternoon.
---------------
So you get all your 9/11 info from ONE website dedicated to debunking what? Non-official 9/11 conspiracy theories? If you won't look at both sides there is no point of this debate. But I am cheered by the fact that the people are waking up in droves, no matter what bushco conspiracy theory supporters think!

US admits Iraq is terror 'cause'

Report says that 11,000 attacks worldwide shows the war has become driving factor for extremists

THREE years after its invasion of Iraq the US Administration acknowledged yesterday that the war has become "a cause" for Islamic extremists worldwide and there is a risk of the country becoming a safe haven for terrorists hoping to launch fresh attacks on America.

According to CIA data released yesterday, there were 11,111 terrorist incidents last year, killing more than 14,600 non-combatants, including 8,300 in Iraq. Of the 56 American civilians killed by terrorists in 2005, some 47 of them were in Iraq.

The figures in the State Department’≥ annual report on terror represented a fourfold rise compared with 2004, partly because it has adopted a broader definition of such incidents since having to withdraw data used two years ago on the ground that it was grossly understated. Officials conceded yesterday that the rising violence in Iraq was a factor in last year’≥ figures, saying that fatalities from terrorism there had "probably doubled".

More HERE

*****end of clip*****

"Mission Accomplished"

capt

"Anyone out there looking forward to seeing the new film United 93?"

Not me. I'd love to see a documentary about flight 93 but if I'm going to watch Hollywood or an independent film, I'll pick a good one. I also have a problem trivializing the event in for-profit enterprise and taking poetic license with the events of UA93 when there are so many questions about that day that need to be answered.

How about you David? Right back at you. How about the rest of the cornblogging crowd? Hmmm?

And since this is the Flight 93 thread, here is a fitting article:

Universal's Flight 93 'Hijacked' By Truth Seekers
Forum moderators deleting entire threads in real time

Paul Joseph Watson/Prison Planet.com | April 29 2006

Universal Studio's Flight 93 movie online forum has been completely infiltrated by people opposing the official government 9/11 fable and its moderators are having to delete entire threads in real time deeming them, "inappropriate."

A cursory visit to the forum confirms that the entire website has been turned into a battle ground for countering the government apologist propaganda being regurgitated in an impetuous lunge to give credibility to a tale about as reality-based as Humpty Dumpty.

The establishment press is spewing forth hit pieces as fast as its antiquated 'one column per columnist per week' ratio can muster. USA Today were the latest to use this shockudrama screen drivel as a pugel to try and bash a truth movement spreading like wildfire across the four corners of the cyber globe.

I have a policy of issuing rebuttals to the most distasteful hit pieces but now I'm content to sit back and just lap up the hilarity of their desperation as every attack piece is met with thousands of angry and informed responses.

The Universal website carries a message at the top of the page stating, "We apologize for the removal of the message boards - due to technical difficulties all previous threads have been inadvertantly deleted. We invite you to renew your dialog and discuss your thoughts on the film."
(I went there and that is exactly what it said, but I would estimate that at least 85% of the comments were bashing that movie to pieces)

Yeah and the moon is made of cheese.

They deleted a whole backlog of threads because they uniformly exposed the fact that Greengrass' shill excuse for a movie is just another manufactured movie script, much like the government's version of 9/11.

"Inappropriate posts which include profanity, defamations, or threats will be removed. Posts that are not deemed appropriate for a particular thread may be moved by the moderator, says the site." By 'defamation' they mean defamation of the official yarn that would put Hans Christian Anderson to shame and truly is an insult to the victims of 9/11.

On the flip side websites like Counterpunch and even the Philadelphia Daily News are carrying balanced pieces highlighting unanswered questions about Flight 93 that were carefully avoided in the new release.

Universal are removing dissenting posts so fast that children who suck their thumbs and believe the establishment Jack and Jill version of 9/11 are now starting to look like the majority. Visit the forum and show them that a committed and educated minority will always triumph over an ignorant brainwashed mass of stupefied zombies.
-----------
HAHAHA, take THAT you lying, traitorous murderers!

Dear frog march, I think I have made my position clear :-)

I liked these films:

A Night at the Opera
Adaptation
Amelie
City of God
Duck Soup
From Hell
Horse Feathers
House of Sand and Fog
In the Bedroom
Jackie Brown
Magnolia
Match Point
Saving Private Ryan
Shaun of the Dead
Sideways
The Butterfly Effect
The Fog of War
The Life of David Gale
True Romance

9/11- WTC Molten Metal Pics+Video

Professor Steven E. Jones from BYU has updated his research paper on the collapses of WTC1, WTC2, and WTC7.

The report also includes an image from Ground Zero showing molten hot steel, presumably weeks after 9/11. How temperatures exceeding 1500 degrees could be found in the sub-basements of the WTC towers weeks (and even months) after 9/11 has yet to be fully explained.

You can also find a video linked in his report which comments on the lava like core found weeks after 9/11 here

*****end of clip*****

You too can be an eye witness! Who should I believe the "official version" or my lying eyes?

capt

Who's gonna SHOW solidarity on Monday???

As the reich-wing is launching a campaign to counter the illegal "aliens" pursuit of HUMAN rights [see http://www.debbieschlussel.com/archives/2006/04/no_meat_monday.html#trackbacks for a case in point], i'm really curious as to how many of you will walk out in a show of support for America's most maligned citizens...and since MY Oxford American College dictionary also defines citizen as: an inhabitant of a particular town or city...methinks WE should ALL show support on Monday for these less-than-slaves "sub-humans" in our midst!!!

Of course, by not working on Monday i'll have to listen to Lynn Samuels tirade against this human filth...but as a BLACK man with Jewish, Irish, and REAL American ancestry...the cry of "never again" is not just a dittohead phrase to me.

Flight 93 is nothing more than another source of mindless entertainment being used to divert attention from what's really going on in this country. And, it will once again drag on the sympathies of the oblivious.

Rush Limbaugh was addicted to Oxycontin, which requires a special prescription to be able to obtain the drug from local pharmacies. No call-ins and no online buys are permitted. If he is correct and there was no doctor shopping, which I'm skeptical of-then the doctor that gave him the drugs was complicit in all of this too.

www.crooksandliars.com

Bush Rejects Calls for Tax on Oil Profits

WASHINGTON (AP) -- President Bush said Friday that taxing enormous oil industry profits is not the way to calm Americans' anxieties about pain at the gas pump, and that his "inclination and instincts" are that major oil companies are not intentionally overcharging drivers.

Bush's remarks suggested the former Texas oilman is unlikely to take harsh action against oil companies despite public anger about the rising cost of fuel. Gasoline is averaging $2.92 a gallon across the country, up 69 cents from a year ago, according to AAA's daily fuel gauge report.

With politicians concerned the issue could tilt what are expected to be close midterm elections this fall, the president and many in Congress have been rushing to offer solutions, most of which would offer little immediate relief.

Some Democrats have viewed this week's announcement by major oil companies of huge first-quarter profits as a chance to renew their push for a windfall profits tax. But though a few Republicans, including Sen. Arlen Specter of Pennsylvania, have said the idea ought to be examined, Bush and most GOP lawmakers strongly oppose it.

"The temptation in Washington is to tax everything," the president said in a wide-ranging news conference.

More HERE

*****end of clip*****

No, nobody is talking about taxing everything just taxing the windfall profits the big oil companies are willing to admit to.

No wonder his poll numbers are tanking. $1.29 here in ABQ in 2000 more than twice that now and the government want to send us $100?

capt

DEMS NEED A NATIONAL SECURITY PLATFORM
Beinart offers his view

NEW YORK Democrats may feel they are riding high, heading into the midterm elections with President Bush?s approval rating at an all-time low, but Peter Beinart offers a warning, and a new direction, for the party in a feature piece upcoming this Sunday in The New York Times Magazine. It?s titled provocatively, ?The Rehabilitation of the Cold-War Liberal.?

The article is adapted from his forthcoming book, ?The Good Fight.? Beinart is currently editor-at-large for The New Republic.

Beinart warns that it is not enough for the Democrats to simply run on ?competence? this year, rather than telling Americans ?what their vision is.? For better or worse, the Republicans have such a vision, which voters understand: ?America represents good in an epic struggle against evil.?

Democrats have some good foreign-policy minds and even some worthy foreign-policy proposals but no ?coherent story about the post-9/11 world....Before Democrats can conquer their ideological weakness, they must first conquer their ideological amnesia,? he declares.

The problem is, ?Liberals don?t have a script because they don?t have a Reagan.? Their most recent presidents: Jimmy «°rter, considered a ?failure? in the international field, and Bill Clinton, who allegedly didn?t have to do much because foreign policy was ?peripheral? when he was in charge. (Beinart does not mention that Clinton at least ignored pleas to invade and occupy Iraq.)

While conservatives have "at least told a coherent political story, with deep historical roots, about what keeps America safe and what makes it great," liberals "have offered adjectives drawn from focus groups and policy proposals linked by no larger theme."

So what are the Dems to do? According to Beinart, they should look back to the late 1940s and 1950s and embrace the cold war liberalism of the time, best represented by Reinhold Niebuhr and George F. Kennan.

Besides being tough and anti-isolationist, this is defined by ?a struggle not merely for democracy but for economic opportunity as well, in the belief that the former required the latter to survived.? It also requires admitting that even in fighting evil America must admit that we are not "inherently good." He also calls for ?generosity at home? as well as ?generosity abroad.?

But how all this differs from current Democratic philosophy is hard to discern.

www.editorandpublisher.com

The thought of Limbaugh and Rove going to jail warms the cockles of my heart.

NEIL YOUNG
LIVING WITH WAR
listen free on-line

Oxycontin is a nasty addiction. It compares to heroin. Once hooked, the chance of relapse is extremely high. Withdrawal is four days of hell, no sleep, diarrhea, hallucination, ache and pain to the marrow in your bones. I think Limbaugh is bad for the country but I wouldn?t wish an oxycontin addiction on anyone.

you know what's truly odd about 911? wtc6 exploded for no apparent reason whatsoever:
start here to see the mysterious explosion of wtc6.

Colbert shakes up Bill Kristol over PNAC ties

Direct to |VIDEO|

COLBERT: Speaking of thinking alike, you were a member, or are a member of the Project for a New American Century, correct?

KRISTOL: I am

COLBERT: Were or am?

KRISTOL: Were and am.

COLBERT: How's that Project coming?

KRISTOL: Well it's?

COLBERT: How's the New American Century? Looks good to me, right?

KRISTOL: I think it, Ahh. . .I'm speechless.

COLBERT: Really?

KRISTOL: Yeah, we've sort of, the Project for a New American Century, we're one of the few people?

COLBERT: Come on, it's a terrific New American Century, right?

KRISTOL: Well, I think we're doing ok.

COLBERT: You, Rummy, Wolfowitz, Cheney, Pearle, Feith, all you guys, right?

KRISTOL: Well, we fought back after 9/11 and I'm proud of what we've done in Afghanistan and in Iraq, yes.

COLBERT: Well, this is pre-9/11, you guys had the Project in the 90s?

KRISTOL: Absolutely, and we thought we should have been fighting back more in the 90s.

COLBERT: Right, we should have invaded Iraq, you know, then you said.

KRISTOL: We should have, actually.

COLBERT: Exactly.

KRISTOL: If we had finished the job in 1991 it would have been a lot easier.

COLBERT: A lot of people are bailing on this whole Iraq war idea. But you're not, right?

KRISTOL: Correct.

COLBERT: You're still onboard?

KRISTOL: I am onboard.

COLBERT: The grand experiment?

KRISTOL: No, it's not a grand experiment.

COLBERT: It's not? It's a little experiment?

KRISTOL: No, it's an unfortunate necessity that you cannot allow dictators to kill their own people and you cannot allow dictators to threaten their neighbors.

COLBERT: Which dictator do we take down next?

KRISTOL: Well, I wish we could take down more, actually. You know, it'd be nice to?

COLBERT: Wait a second, we cannot allow dictators to kill their own people. That's a very simple statement sir, which I support wholeheartedly. Back it up!

KRISTOL: I'm with you.

COLBERT: Who do we go after next? Iran? Come on!

KRISTOL: I think we may have to take military action against?

COLBERT: Let's get some boots on the ground, sir!

KRISTOL: I wish. . .we may have to do that. We have to do that in the Sudan.

COLBERT: Is the military option on the table in Iran?

KRISTOL: Absolutely, absolutely. And in Sudan.

COLBERT: Ok. How about the nuclear option in Iran?

KRISTOL: No, no.

COLBERT: Come on!

KRISTOL: No, I differ with you on this.

COLBERT: The President says?

KRISTOL: You're a tougher guy than I am on this.

COLBERT: I'm a neo-neocon. You guys aren't tough for me.

KRISTOL: I'm an anti-nuke neocon and you're a pro-nuke neocon.

When the White House press corps first starts asking questions of new White House Press Secretary Tony Snow, the first question should be, "Sir, exactly what are you trying to hide?". There are a plethora of glib answers one could give to such a question, but the fact remains, Mr. Snow was a regular poster over at Free Republic ( http://www.freerepublic.com ), and as one can see from the link and quote below, overnight when it was announced he would be the new press secretary, the mountain of information Mr. Snow had submitted and had posted on the site disappeared. What is he hiding? What sorts of comments is he afraid might see the light of day?

www.opednews.com

Senator Kennedy, The Democrats, And Iran

Earlier this week, I was invited to a blogger call with Senator Kennedy to discuss the principles in his book, America: Back on Track. (I'll post a detailed review of the book soon, focusing on how it plays into the November elections). One of the core principles of his book is that we need "a new definition of national security for a changed world." Military power, Kennedy argues, is only one facet of securing our safety. Diplomacy, economic development, and human rights need to become part of the national security debate.

www.dailykos.com

Five members of the U.S. Congress were arrested on Friday at a demonstration held at the Sudan embassy to protest atrocities in that country's Darfur region, congressional aides said.

The lawmakers, all Democrats, were Reps. Tom Lantos of California, James McGovern and John Olver of Massachusetts, James Moran of Virginia, and Sheila Jackson Lee of Texas, aides to McGovern and Lantos said.

Ohio Rep. Jean Schmidt has been reprimanded by the Ohio Elections Commission for padding her resume. She said she had two college degrees when she had only one, a violation of campaign law.

The Washington Post reports on another scandal today, one more along the usual lines of Republican chicanery, this one dealing with money. Lots and lots of taxpayers' money.

The cost of the war in Iraq will reach $320 billion after the expected passage next month of an emergency spending bill currently before the Senate, and that total is likely to more than double before the war ends, the Congressional Research Service estimated this week. . . .

Once the war spending bill is passed, military and diplomatic costs will have reached $101.8 billion this fiscal year, up from $87.3 billion in 2005, $77.3 billion in 2004 and $51 billion in 2003, the year of the invasion, congressional analysts said. Even if a gradual troop withdrawal begins this year, war costs in Iraq and Afghanistan are likely to rise by an additional $371 billion during the phaseout, the report said, citing a Congressional Budget Office study. When factoring in costs of the war in Afghanistan, the $811 billion total for both wars would have far exceeded the inflation-adjusted $549 billion cost of the Vietnam War.

The report apparently contains such phrases as "These factors, however, are not enough to explain a 50-percent increase of over $20 billion in operating costs" and "These reasons are not sufficient, however, to explain the level of increases." Relatedly, the Post reports that "Of the total war spending, the CRS analysis found $4 billion that could not be tracked. It did identify $2.5 billion diverted from other spending authorizations in 2001 and 2002 to prepare for the invasion." I'm fairly sure you're not allowed to "divert" money from other spending authorizations, and you're certainly not supposed to lose $4 billion in untrackable spending. Nor does it sound entirely appropriate for the Pentagon to be running its operation in such a way that the CRS can't discern the causes of 50 percent spending increases.

www.dailykos.com

capt, there is no convincing the convinced, it is what it is, and that's all there is.
"We're clever but we're clueless" says Jack Johnson, and he is absolutely right.
Frog march, those movies you mentioned I am mostly in agreement with, I have recommended "The Life Of David Gale" a couple times. That was exceptional.

A source close to the bribery case, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the ongoing investigation, told the Union-Tribune that Mitchell Wade, who pleaded guilty in February to bribing Cunningham, told federal prosecutors that he periodically helped arrange for a prostitute for the then-congressman.

A limousine would pick up Cunningham and a prostitute and take them to the ADCS hospitality suite, Wade reportedly told investigators. Federal agents are investigating whether other legislators had similar arrangements with Wilkes or Wade, a business associate of Wilkes who ran his own defense contracting company, MZM Inc.

The CIA director appears to be implicated, and perhaps as many as half a dozen Republican congressmen could be snared in this sex scandal.

Last night on MSNBC's Scarborough Country, Dean Calbreath of the San Diego Union Tribune - which recently won a Pulitzer Prize for its coverage of the Cunningham case - said that "as many as a half a dozen" members of Congress could ultimately be implicated in the prostitution scandal.

www.dailykos.com